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PostPosted: Feb Tue 20, 2007 11:50 pm 
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Old Skool.
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Quote:
Brand Problems
Lexus 136
Mercury 151
Buick 153
Cadillac 163
Toyota 179
Acura 184
Honda 194
Jaguar 210
BMW 212
Infiniti 210
Lincoln 220
Ford 224
Oldsmobile 224
INDUSTRY AVERAGE 227
Chrysler 232
Pontiac 232






people that dont buy American cars today are just uninformed. why GM doesnt advertise this shit is beyond me.


At todays rate, 20 years from now, every single person in the U.S. will be working at starbucks making $7/hour and driving foreign cars wondering where their job went.


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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 12:17 am 
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thanks for raining on her parade, crybabies...


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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 1:03 am 
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when I heard Kevin saying something like that a few weeks ago, It kind of surprised me & made me wonder about my point of reference. So I took a little informal servay of folks @ work & my friends, & I have to say that what they said & what that data says were WAY different. in short, the domestic folks were less happy than the import folks.

Bob

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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 8:05 am 
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Well said Chris...

Don't get me wrong Dalra and Jacob, it is your money to do with what you want. Being in the industry, I just don't understand the thought behind buying a foreign car when the domestic cars for the most part are just as good... Doesn't anyone care about the middle class and what is happening to them??? Lets face it the auto indrustry made a middle class...

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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 8:09 am 
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Bob, I think what you are finding is a peception for the most part. If everyone is going around saying that domestics suck then the majority of people will believe that. And if they are going by experience then I would say that they are going from years ago when there was a difference.... Just my thoughts...



I don't want anyone pissed because they think I am telling you what to buy. I would just like to inform everyone what the facts are today....

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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 8:20 am 
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bbnova wrote:
Come on guys, this isn't the 1990's. You are talking about perceived quality not actual quality.... Our quality matches if not beats the imports currently. Did anyone hear that Honda I think it was had more recalls than they actually built last year??? Of course not.. I wonder why???


It was Toyota -

Toyota recalled more cars in 2006 than they sold.

K


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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 8:23 am 
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Jacob & Darla - Look at the next to last paragraph. Honda had 11 vehicles at the top of Consumer Report's reliability list. On the least reliable list Honda is noticably absent . You made a good choice! :wink:


Consumer Reports 10 best and worst for resale. read the entire report at:
http://www.consumerreports.org


Top 10

1. Toyota Prius
2. Mini Cooper
3. Scion xB
4. BMW M3
5. Lexus RX
6. BMW 6-Series
7. Lexus GX
8. Acura TSX
9. Scion xA
10. Honda Civic & Civic Hybrid

Bottom 10

1. Ford Freestar
2. Ford Crown Victoria
3. Buick Rainier
4. Lincoln Town Car
5. Dodge Caravan/Grand Caravan
6. Mercury Grand Marquis
7. GMC Envoy
8. Ford Explorer
9. Buick Rendezvous
10. Chrysler Town & Country

Best & worst in car reliability read the entire report at:
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars ... /index.htm

Our latest survey forecasts which cars are likely to be troublesome and which will hold up well.

Our 2006 Annual Car Reliability Survey, the largest of its kind, gathered responses on about 1.3 million vehicles from Consumer Reports and ConsumerReports.org subscribers. These results underpin the most comprehensive reliability data you will find anywhere.

Such a large survey response--30 percent more than in 2005--allows us to provide reliability data on some very recently introduced models, such as the Honda Fit, the redesigned Chevrolet Tahoe, and the Lexus ES350. We can also report on some expensive and low-volume models like the Mercedes-Benz SL and the Porsche 911.

• Several new and redesigned models were very reliable, countering the trend of most models' having more problems in the first year of a new design. Especially notable are some new U.S. models. The Lincoln Zephyr, introduced in 2006, was the second most reliable upscale sedan after the 2007 Lexus ES350. The Zephyr's platform mates, the Ford Fusion and Mercury Milan, also new for 2006, scored slightly better than V6 versions of the Honda Accord and Toyota Camry. The Buick Lucerne and Cadillac DTS both scored above average in their first year.
• Above-average first-year reliability for the new Subaru Tribeca makes Subaru the only automaker to have its entire lineup of cars recommended by Consumer Reports. All Subaru's except the WRX STi have better-than-average predicted reliability. The STi is average. Mercedes-Benz, on the other hand, does not have a single model reliable enough to be recommended.
• Nissan's reliability has improved somewhat. Last year, the Quest, Armada, Titan, and especially the Infiniti QX56, all built at Nissan's Canton, Miss. factory, had the worst reliability in our survey. This year, while the predicted reliability of the Armada and QX56 are still about 135 percent worse than the average vehicle, they had half as many problems as they did in last year's survey. The Quest, while still much worse than average this year, had fewer problems than minivans from General Motors.
Of the 47 vehicles on the most-reliable list, 39 were from Japanese automakers. Six came from the domestic automakers, and one each came from South Korea and Europe. Twenty-one Toyota vehicles earned top ratings. Honda had 11 vehicles at the top of our ratings. Ford, General Motors, and Subaru each had three, Mitsubishi and Nissan each had two, while Hyundai and Mini each had one.

* Of the 45 least reliable models, 19 were European, 20 were from U.S. manufacturers, 5 were Japanese, and 1 was South Korean. General Motors had 12, Mercedes-Benz had 8, Ford and Nissan each had 5, Chrysler and Volkswagen each had 3, BMW and Jaguar each had 2, while Kia, Land Rover, Porsche, Saab, and Volvo each had 1.

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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 8:26 am 
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My point Dick is of course that would be the case. If the public is told that the quality is bad for domestics then the Imports will have a higher resale as they would be more sought out...

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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 8:32 am 
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I understand where you are coming from Kevin. It's interesting that J. D Powers and Consumer Reports claim to have similar study/review methods but come up with entirely different results. Both claim info is gathered from actual vehicle owners based on thier experience with the vehicle make.

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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 8:36 am 
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I'm sorry but I don't consider the Honda Accord they purchased to be a foreign vehicle. That vehicle is produced at two locations in Ohio, not to mention the third plant for engines and a forth for motorcycles. I've been to the Marysville plant for a design review for exterior mirrors produced by Magna/Donnelly right here in Michigan and the facility is awesome down there. This was two years ago and at that point that facility just passed the 9 million mark for US built Accords. 8)

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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 8:43 am 
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so kevin, personal experience should not be considered when making a purchase?


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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 8:57 am 
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Most definately Jacob. My points are...


1) Without an auto industry, this country will be in bad shape. Me, you and everyone else. Doesn't the fact that your money is leaving this country mean anything to you???

2) All imformation should go into a purchase, including previous experience. The quality now, today, is as good or better. My hope here that with your next purchase you will take all this into consideration. It is your money to spend how you wish.

All things considered, I myself just can't justify giving my money to another country when there are products here that the money stays here and keeps my fellow Americans working.

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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 9:23 am 
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honda provides jobs for americans in the US as well.

do you ever shop at walmart?


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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 9:31 am 
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I understand that Honda has plants here Jacob. My point is, I try and base my decision on what is best for this country while still getting what I want and need.


I usually shop at Meijer....

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PostPosted: Feb Wed 21, 2007 9:52 am 
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Fred Meijer is a jack ass, but I still shop there also :lol:

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